Confused About Bull's Strike - Guild Wars Forums

ac1inferno · Nov 04, 2008, 03:00 AM // 03:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuildWiki

Full: If this attack hits a moving foe, you strike for +5...25 damage, and your target is knocked down.

Concise: Deals +5...25 damage and causes knock-down if target foe is moving.

So do I only strike for plus damage and my target is knocked down if this attack hits a moving foe?

Or does it always deal plus damage and then causes knock-down if target foe is moving?

The full skill detail and concise skill detail seems to contradict one another when I read it.

TheOrangeFalcon · Nov 04, 2008, 03:14 AM // 03:14

To me when i read both it seems as you get the + while someone is moving. Someone should test it though. Not me cuz i'm getting offline in a bit.

EliteOwner · Nov 04, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Only when target foe is moving. Both read the same way, but concise descriptions can often be a little fuzzy for skills like this.

Daisuko · Nov 04, 2008, 04:02 AM // 04:02

You always deal bonus damage. Knockdown is optional.

zelgadissan · Nov 04, 2008, 04:30 AM // 04:30

^ Uh, no. Unless you can explain the screenshot I just tested.

Bull's adds the +damage if the target is moving. End of story.

Edit: adding another picture of the weapon (crap shield, don't remind me QQ) since it's a PvE axe. Basically wanting to prove it's max damage.

Judas Paladin · Nov 04, 2008, 04:32 AM // 04:32

You land KD you get extra dmg. If you don't KD, you dont get the extra dmg. That's all there is to it. Concise description is confusing but reads

Deals +5...25 damage and causes knock-down if target foe is moving.

Keyword is IF target foe is moving.

Compare this to concise skill descrip for something like Irresistible Blow

Deals +5...17 damage. Deals 5...17 damage and causes knock-down if blocked.

the + damage clause is not attached to any condition and ends in a period thus it deals extra damage regardless.

Other examples

Critical chop
Deals +5...17 damage. Interrupts an action if you land a critical hit.

Lacerating chop
Deals +5...17 damage. Inflicts Bleeding condition (5...17 seconds) if target foe is knocked-down.

Seeking blade
Deals +1...16 damage. Deals 1...16 damage and inflicts Bleeding condition (25 seconds) if blocked.

get the idea?

ALF71BE · Nov 04, 2008, 04:37 AM // 04:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas Paladin

You land KD you get extra dmg. If you don't KD, you dont get the extra dmg. That's all there is to it.

Eh, I don't think so. If your target is enchanted with, say, Aura of Stability, you'll still land the +damage, but no KD.

N E D M · Nov 04, 2008, 05:40 AM // 05:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALF71BE

Eh, I don't think so. If your target is enchanted with, say, Aura of Stability, you'll still land the +damage, but no KD.

if target is moving when hit, bonus dmg is applied.

ac1inferno · Nov 04, 2008, 02:38 PM // 14:38

Thanks everyone, that really cleared it up for me. Now I have three more questions, but it's kind of off-topic. It's minor though so I don't know if I should really start a new thread for it. If a mod thinks I should, then I will.

Question #1:
When an axe warrior is spiking, is it better to go Eviscerate and then Executioner's Strike? Or is it better to Executioner's Strike and then Eviscerate? Deep wound used to not show up until the second hit, making it look like it hurts more. But now that deep wound shows up, would it be better to put it at the end of the chain so there's less chance of it being removed?

Question #2:
When a ranger helps with a spike, is it better to use Sloth Hunter Shot then Savage Shot? Or is Keen Arrow and Savage Shot better? Keen Arrow will deal more damage than Sloth Hunter if it hits critical, but are the chances big enough? Or should I not risk it and stick with Sloth's Hunter since it seems easier to hit when they are not using a skill? Is it a bigger chance for Keen Arrow to hit for critical? Or Sloth Hunter when they are not using a skill?

Question #3:
I noticed that Shield of Force blocks ranged attacks as well. Does Shield Bash also work like this? Or is it only for melee? The skill details seem to say that it blocks the any next attack skill, and then disables for +15 seconds and knocks down.

ALF71BE · Nov 04, 2008, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Eviscerate then Exe's, else the DW won't trigger.

I've seen it does block bow attacks. But I don't know if it disables them, I wasn't paying attention.

zelgadissan · Nov 04, 2008, 07:14 PM // 19:14

1) Eviscerate -> Executioner's. Alf said why.
2) Sloth's -> Savage. Maybe Keen if you're running Go For the Eyes!, but I'd still probably run Sloth's.
3) It blocks something like Melandru's Shot, but since it's not melee it doesn't knockdown and it doesn't disable.

ac1inferno · Nov 04, 2008, 11:26 PM // 23:26

Okay thanks everyone.

Nov 04, 2008, 02:38 PM // 14:38	#9
ac1inferno Desert Nomad Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Boston Guild: We D Shot Your Stances [GODS] Profession: A/W	Thanks everyone, that really cleared it up for me. Now I have three more questions, but it's kind of off-topic. It's minor though so I don't know if I should really start a new thread for it. If a mod thinks I should, then I will. Question #1: When an axe warrior is spiking, is it better to go Eviscerate and then Executioner's Strike? Or is it better to Executioner's Strike and then Eviscerate? Deep wound used to not show up until the second hit, making it look like it hurts more. But now that deep wound shows up, would it be better to put it at the end of the chain so there's less chance of it being removed? Question #2: When a ranger helps with a spike, is it better to use Sloth Hunter Shot then Savage Shot? Or is Keen Arrow and Savage Shot better? Keen Arrow will deal more damage than Sloth Hunter if it hits critical, but are the chances big enough? Or should I not risk it and stick with Sloth's Hunter since it seems easier to hit when they are not using a skill? Is it a bigger chance for Keen Arrow to hit for critical? Or Sloth Hunter when they are not using a skill? Question #3: I noticed that Shield of Force blocks ranged attacks as well. Does Shield Bash also work like this? Or is it only for melee? The skill details seem to say that it blocks the any next attack skill, and then disables for +15 seconds and knocks down. Last edited by ac1inferno; Nov 04, 2008 at 03:05 PM // 15:05..

Nov 04, 2008, 03:14 AM // 03:14	#2
TheOrangeFalcon Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Cali Guild: Trinity of the Ascended[ToA] Profession: E/	To me when i read both it seems as you get the + while someone is moving. Someone should test it though. Not me cuz i'm getting offline in a bit.

Nov 04, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32	#3
EliteOwner Ascalonian Squire Join Date: May 2006 Profession: W/	Only when target foe is moving. Both read the same way, but concise descriptions can often be a little fuzzy for skills like this.

Nov 04, 2008, 04:02 AM // 04:02	#4
Daisuko Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: California Guild: [Vr] Profession: E/Me	You always deal bonus damage. Knockdown is optional.

Nov 04, 2008, 04:32 AM // 04:32	#6
Judas Paladin Krytan Explorer Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Guild: LARGE BUSTS OF WONDERLAND [BOOB] Profession: W/Mo	You land KD you get extra dmg. If you don't KD, you dont get the extra dmg. That's all there is to it. Concise description is confusing but reads Deals +5...25 damage and causes knock-down if target foe is moving. Keyword is IF target foe is moving. Compare this to concise skill descrip for something like Irresistible Blow Deals +5...17 damage. Deals 5...17 damage and causes knock-down if blocked. the + damage clause is not attached to any condition and ends in a period thus it deals extra damage regardless. Other examples Critical chop Deals +5...17 damage. Interrupts an action if you land a critical hit. Lacerating chop Deals +5...17 damage. Inflicts Bleeding condition (5...17 seconds) if target foe is knocked-down. Seeking blade Deals +1...16 damage. Deals 1...16 damage and inflicts Bleeding condition (25 seconds) if blocked. get the idea?

Nov 04, 2008, 07:09 PM // 19:09	#10
ALF71BE Jungle Guide Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: In your fridge, stealing your pickles. for mah subway Profession: R/	Eviscerate then Exe's, else the DW won't trigger. I've seen it does block bow attacks. But I don't know if it disables them, I wasn't paying attention.

Nov 04, 2008, 07:14 PM // 19:14	#11
zelgadissan Forge Runner Join Date: Feb 2008 Guild: The Warrior Priests [WP] Profession: Me/Rt	1) Eviscerate -> Executioner's. Alf said why. 2) Sloth's -> Savage. Maybe Keen if you're running Go For the Eyes!, but I'd still probably run Sloth's. 3) It blocks something like Melandru's Shot, but since it's not melee it doesn't knockdown and it doesn't disable.

Nov 04, 2008, 11:26 PM // 23:26	#12
ac1inferno Desert Nomad Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Boston Guild: We D Shot Your Stances [GODS] Profession: A/W	Okay thanks everyone.